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Thread: State of the Game: March 2017

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    Dawn of the Dragons Developer Mouse's Avatar
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    State of the Game: March 2017

    Introduction
    Greetings and welcome to March adventurers!

    Today we’ll be covering the following topics:
    • Campaign: Black Hand Holdout
    • Gauntlet: Chalua
    • Magic Feedback: Where we’re at now
    • Event Raids Unleashed!
    • Perception Tiers


    Campaign: Black Hand Holdout
    This month heralds the release of the new Black Hand Holdout Guild Campaign!

    Hidden deep within the forests of West Kruna there stands an impressive fortress occupied by the Black Hand Bandits. Guilds will storm the keep and uncover more information about the Black Hand Bandits through lore found on item drops and hopefully put an end to this group once and for all.

    Like previous Campaigns, Black Hand Holdout features two difficulty modes, a plethora of new loot including equipment, troops and more and also features craftable upgrades for a variety of items.



    Campaigns take a tremendous amount of art and design time to fully complete which is why they aren’t frequently released, however we agree that their current schedule is too infrequent and are working on processes and systems internally to allow us to release new Campaigns more often.


    Gauntlet: Chalua
    The Chalua Gauntlet returns this month! It will feature several new items in the shop but will otherwise be mostly unchanged. In the future we might update the leaderboard rewards but in general we feel good about where they are and what they’re accomplishing.

    We’ve been monitoring your feedback regarding Gauntlet release cycles and feel we’ve hit a good stride now having three separate versions in rotation. It’s very likely we’ll release new versions at a later date, but we’d love to hear your feedback in this thread about the return of Chalua at this time. Does it feel well timed? Do you wish it was longer before it appeared? Sooner? We look forward to reading your thoughts on the matter, adventurers!

    Magic Feedback: Where we’re at now
    In the February 2017 State of the Game post we asked for your feedback about a potential magic management system. The feedback has been mostly positive and in favor for it along with some great suggestions for ways we could potentially improve it from what we already had planned.

    For this feature we’re going to roll it out in pieces. We’ve had success with this in the past and feel it will apply well in this situation. The first piece we’re going to work on is improving the way you find and select your magics to begin with; this involves things like filters and other “smart” systems when you’re selecting your magics for a raid.

    After that we’ll work on the “meat” of the feature which involves the actual magic management for what magics get applied to your raid. You had a lot of great ideas and we’re considering some of those proposed changes for this system.

    Why release this in parts?
    We’ve found historically trying to tackle too many changes at once can be jarring for a player and it’s just much easier for us to tackle these things in bite sized chunks as opposed to massive “meals”. It allows us to focus on smaller portions of the feature and give them more polish and improve their quality.

    Why is this system such a large undertaking? Why wasn’t it done sooner?
    The Dawn magic system is innately very complicated and if we make a mistake with it, it could have large-scale ramifications. So, we like to be cautious when dealing with it. We’ve done several changes over the years on the backend which have improved things pretty dramatically overall (from a design and performance standpoint) but it definitely takes a bit longer to do.

    As far as why it has taken so long to get to this: some of it is priority. There were other features or changes in the game we just felt were more important at the time. We now feel it’s time to tackle this feature so it’s where we’re headed. We wanted to get some community feedback before we got too deep into the nuts and bolts because there could be ideas or features you really wanted that we simply hadn’t thought of yet. We’re surprisingly human! (except me, I’m a dwarf).

    When?
    I can’t really give you an exact date, but we’re actively working on it. So once we feel it’s ready we’ll get it into your hands, which we’d like to do as soon as possible!

    Event Raids Unleashed!
    Internally we’ve been cooking up some new dev-tech that should greatly improve how we summon Event and World raids and it has a few other added benefits as well.

    This month we’ll be testing the waters with an influx of multiple Event Raids going on at the same time. We’ve done this in the past, but doing so was rather difficult and came with the potential for a lot of problems. We’ve now refined the tech which we’ve been secretly testing for the past few weeks with great success.

    In addition to be able to summon a plethora of Event and/or World Raids simultaneously, we’re also testing the possibility of adding Magics to World and Event raids that don’t even innately have a Magic slot in them; Hero Hunter World Raid with Midas Touch on it!? Heck yeah! (Just kidding. Mostly…). This could give a fresh new spin to an otherwise aged raid or event.

    We’ll continue to test this tech and if things continue to go smoothly you could see some of it applied as early as this month.

    Perception Tiers
    We’re working on a Perception update that we hope to release as early as this month which will include new Perception tiers, new items found at those tiers (including new consumables) as well as new recipes.

    In regards to consumables: we’re looking to add an entirely new line of consumables which will be more powerful and have better SP payouts than what exists currently (so a potion for Attack, a potion for Defense, etc). We want this update to feel significant and meaningful for those of you have invested into the Perception stat.

    While we’re already actively working on this, we’d love to hear more of your feedback on the kinds of things you’d like to see at a high amount of Perception. Would you want new raids to drop? Do you want equipment sets, boosts, generals, etc. As I said, we’d like to get this into your hands this month but it’s possible it might need to get pushed back a tad.

    Conclusion
    Thank you for reading the March State of the Game post! As you can see we’re busy working on a variety of things for March and beyond, but if there’s a topic you feel we’ve overlooked and you’d like to talk about in more depth, please bring it up in this post and we’ll do our best to answer your questions.

    Until next time, adventurers!

  2. #2
    Night Blade 'Beta Nu''s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post

    Perception Tiers
    Were working on a Perception update that we hope to release as early as this month which will include new Perception tiers, new items found at those tiers (including new consumables) as well as new recipes.

    In regards to consumables: were looking to add an entirely new line of consumables which will be more powerful and have better SP payouts than what exists currently (so a potion for Attack, a potion for Defense, etc). We want this update to feel significant and meaningful for those of you have invested into the Perception stat.

    While were already actively working on this, wed love to hear more of your feedback on the kinds of things youd like to see at a high amount of Perception. Would you want new raids to drop? Do you want equipment sets, boosts, generals, etc. As I said, wed like to get this into your hands this month but its possible it might need to get pushed back a tad.
    a new Personal raid would be awesome as a Perception drop. Maybe something with a bit of meat in it say 1t health.
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    I feel mostly positive about this SotG.
    1. New camp is really due, I'm looking foward to it. This should give more breathing room to the otherwise overcrowded camps on CD.
    2. Gauntlet is nice, I was half-expecting it for this month. 6 Gauntlets per year and 3 different ones feels right at the moment.
    3. Better magic management will be an essential QoL-Update. I think you're doing well making this your priority. While you're at it, maybe implement a FS-1-hit button like it was suggested in one of the threads.
    4. Ah yeah new perception tiers. Personally, I think a very rare raid essence drop would be fantastic and would make more people quest again. Likewise, I'd like to see a new legendary item, either by rare drop or by collecting certain items from perception rewards to craft it.
    5. After the magic update, could you focus more on another "thing" about Perception? *hint* *hint* Wouldn't it be nice if you could surprise us on Dawniversary with a new awesome interface and functionality regarding Perception?

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    Sister of Radiance Thalain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse
    While we’re already actively working on this, we’d love to hear more of your feedback on the kinds of things you’d like to see at a high amount of Perception. Would you want new raids to drop? Do you want equipment sets, boosts, generals, etc. As I said, we’d like to get this into your hands this month but it’s possible it might need to get pushed back a tad.
    My first priority in this regard would be to make questing more worthwhile. SP are part of it and there should be a way to reduce the TNL penalty of questing at higher levels (Kraken does a fraction of what Tollo or Machaon achieve). Perception drops could help here - the straightforward but somewhat boring way would be adding the occasional Grand potion at those tiers above 300k (and possibly the small ones correspondingly lower). A legendary quest set that takes some serious time and perc to get but has a similar effect to Kraken or just slightly raises XP return while questing when worn (1% per item? That would make a full 10-set including mount and neck approximately Machaon comparable if I calculated right) would fit the bill in a more flashy way. Maybe the first part could start dropping at 200k and the last would require 500k.

    Another way to spice up questing would be to drop several of those old PC sets that are way outdated into the loot tables at higher Perc. Especially the Rainbow Knight sets are highly wanted by collectors and are well beyond outdated in terms of stats, so putting these into the tables would be something I could very much appreciate. And while we're at it, is there a way to differentiate Perc drops by quest difficulty? If yes, that could breathe some life back into the currently zero-reward Hard and Legendary difficulties that just take time and Energy on the way to NM.

    A totally different idea: Defeating a quest boss could have a chance based on Perception (0.5% per 10k?) to immediately summon the corresponding raid. No effect on cooldown - it doesn't touch the player's normal raid timing. It's a free, extra raid. No more and no less. Would help everyone

    Just some random thoughts.

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    Night Blade 'Beta Nu''s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thalain View Post
    is there a way to differentiate Perc drops by quest difficulty? If yes, that could breathe some life back into the currently zero-reward Hard and Legendary difficulties that just take time and Energy on the way to NM.
    .
    some zones Do already drop different sets on Normal - legendary from NM
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    Sister of Radiance Thalain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 'Beta Nu' View Post
    some zones Do already drop different sets on Normal - legendary from NM
    None of the newer ones do so however. They have the essence for completing N and everything else is NM which makes the middle two nothing but a tedious grind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post
    Campaign: Black Hand Holdout
    Excellent, looking forward to the new camp, and more to come.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post
    Gauntlet: Chalua
    No real issues here, I like the schedule so far, IDK if adding a legion boost every run is a real great idea though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post
    Magic Feedback: Where we’re at now
    No problems here with a more moderate release approach, hopefully there will be a smoother rollout this way.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post
    Event Raids Unleashed!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post
    Perception Tiers
    Personally, I love this, maybe a personal raid at a higher perc tier? Don't be afraid for a 1T plus one, it should be E based though.

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    Disciple of the Traveller
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    one thing that might be nice with perception is to have a *few* raids that you need certain levels of perception to effectively hit.

    it could be as simple as your perception has to be past a certain level to be allowed into the raid at all otherwise you get some message about getting lost trying to find the raid or some such. or it could be set so that below a certain perception level, you have a scaled reduction in your damage against the raid to avoid the potential complaints that might come from a raid that some just flat could not join. something like 100K perception is the required perception for a raid, over it you hit normally, below 100K, for each 1K less you do 1% less damage than normal (assume a cloning of the fatigue code from the camps). I would assume somewhere in the raid the level of reduction would be displayed as well as the required perception level.

    game logic being that only with high enough perception can you fully know what you are attacking and how exactly to best damage it.

    this could also be used as a means to steer newer players away from some of the stronger raids initially.

    actually if the mechanic was put in place, you could also have some raids that having perception beyond a certain point reduces your damage. mostly just yet one more method to get in some kind of damage limiting mechanic, hint hint..... but it could be a way to protect smaller raids from the mega monsters out there now just a tiny bit without drastic changes to how the game works maybe.

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    I love hearing about ER and WR reruns. I'm hoping to see the remaining ones that haven't come back since I started playing the game. Hopefully these are on the list:

    ERs: The Gore Gob Riders, Treachery and the Tower, Slaughter in the Snow, All That Glitters

    And for good measure, hopefully these WRs see a return soon too:

    WRs: Old Foes, The New Claw, Corrupted Erebus, The Beautiful Game, Steam Fanatics, Avinashi

    As for the Perception tiers, I like the idea of a new personal raid. A new legendary set would be appreciated too, Epimet would enjoy the boost. As previously mentioned, some old outdated sets would be cool, perhaps in the form of a grab bag that contains a few sets or a drop that you can craft into the grab bag. A drop that crafts into a grab bag has the benefit of being able to scale up with higher tiers. I would also like to see higher chances for getting Writhing Tentacles. I don't care about pano troops, but I do care about getting more tentacles to get more Naiads and to finally get the Pano1 boosts. That said, I wouldn't be opposed to veteran pano troops as either drops by themselves or as a craft using the regular troops.

    PS. Can we see a return of the Qwiladrian Goo quest event? I would love to have the Hybrid Essence and to get another dragon mount.

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    When are you planning on handing out crowns since they are already two days late?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post

    Campaign: Black Hand Holdout

    Yes to this. new camps always a good addition. Adding Legendary camps 1 at a time might might be a good idea. you wont need new camp artwork (only loot art) and by releasing 1 at a time you can scale them as you see fit over time and have some content for us at lower overhead.


    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post
    Magic Feedback: Where were at now
    This continues to be an issue that i'm concerned about. I'm all for finding a way to streamline magic selection as badgering your way through your magic lists when magic has gotten increasingly more specialized over time is a huge pain. this is a change that is much needed.

    The fact that youre still talking about ability to have summoner regulation of magic befuddles me. It feels like a frivolous quality of life update when there are plenty of better quality of life changes you could be working on. A vigilant summoner can do this job already on their own , not to mention this tool has the potential to leave magic slots barren when a user w/ the right magic is not around and opens the door for just as much trolling from users requiring silly magics on their own raids. There are just so so many ways i'd prefer you spend your resources improving the game.

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    Sargaash the Mighty equal
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steeks View Post
    When are you planning on handing out crowns since they are already two days late?
    I had mine yesterday.
    If you want to "ignore" someone on the forum just click their name, click profile, and beneath their avatar you'll see an ignore link. Comes in really handy at times when you don't want to deal with that certain someone's constant negativity.

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    Sargaash the Mighty equal Ahlyis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrolizard View Post
    I love this, maybe a personal raid at a higher perc tier? Don't be afraid for a 1T plus one, it should be E based though.
    I disagree on the E based.

    Personally, I wouldn't mind even higher than 1t, but allowing all 3 types, E/S/H. Higher should be fine, anyone that has high enough Perc for it to drop (I'm expecting 500k+) should also be strong enough to do big time damage.
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    as for the magic selection/casting. mostly if you just give us decent means to sort and hopefully flag up/down magics to shrink the normally visible list would be enough for me. have seen few cases when a summoner of a raid that was actively monitoring their raid when they summoned that could not get the magics they wanted within a couple of minutes. and generally those cases centered more of a lack of anyone with the magic to cast it.

    honestly have a feeling any summoner magic white list/black list set up will end up taking more time than it is worth for most people and just never be used really. anyone not willing to monitor their raid for the few minutes after is summoned is also not likely to take the time to set up the white/black lists for the magics.

    but will say if you must add that in, would much much prefer it to just be a black list of magics that a summoner doesn't want cast.






    as for a way to add camps faster, one simple one is just make a campaign or two that is just a memorial to the first few zones of the game. say have a campaign that is by game logic a re-enactment of the burdens rest to fallows arc as we know everyone in west kruna wants to know what it feels like the be "hero". use the existing art work for those three zones for backgrounds and the node monsters. this could be set up as an extra easy camp or be an excuse to have a more than 20 node campaign. something like 33 total nodes, 10 for each zone plus 1 bottleneck/final node for each of the first three final quest zone bosses.


    and know it been suggested before, maybe could allow us to summon normal and hard modes of camps at the same time perhaps? at least if you insist on the trend that almost none of the loot from the normal mode is contained in the hard mode in anyway.




    as for the gauntlets, one every 2 months is not too overly frequent really, but it would be nice to have more than just 3 different ones in the rotation. in the end, the achiles heel for the gauntlets has largely been the "renting" of rewards. the longer you make the rental time the less of an issue it will be.

    personally still like the idea of gauntlets having a rules of engagement type thing that was suggested where for one gauntlet say dwarf troops get a 10% boost for the duration of it. a little variation between each run of the gauntlets would be nice. its not like we aren't going to have to almost every time tinker with the battalion to update it at the start of each one anyway.

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    Sister of Radiance Thalain's Avatar
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    Another interesting personal raid idea that could also well work as a perception drop: A raid with Health 1. Yes, 1. The catch: It has loot tiers - anywhere from a few m to hundreds of b. You get one hit and only one hit due to the 1 HP health and the oomph of that hit determines what you get. Could even come with a spike magic for personal raids. (10% chance to deal 250% damage. Additional 1750% damage on personal raids.)

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse View Post

    Gauntlet: Chalua
    The Chalua Gauntlet returns this month! It will feature several new items in the shop but will otherwise be mostly unchanged. In the future we might update the leaderboard rewards but in general we feel good about where they are and what they’re accomplishing.

    We’ve been monitoring your feedback regarding Gauntlet release cycles and feel we’ve hit a good stride now having three separate versions in rotation. It’s very likely we’ll release new versions at a later date, but we’d love to hear your feedback in this thread about the return of Chalua at this time. Does it feel well timed? Do you wish it was longer before it appeared? Sooner? We look forward to reading your thoughts on the matter, adventurers!
    I think 5PG is right on the mark with most of the direction of the game highlighted in this post except for gauntlet which seems a bit out of touch.

    As a brief context, let me say I generally like the idea of gauntlet and I dont mind spending money on it if its worth while. I spent $300-400 to get into top 10 of the gauntlet that ran in July or August when the rewards (i mainly wanted to at least get BoM) were still somewhat relevant.. see further explanation below.

    I think the rotations for gauntlet are fine and the rewards for ranks 11-50 and lower are generally OK. The rewards for #1 spot/tier 1 (smite and karaduchi troop) are decent, although no where near the value for the cost of 5000-8000+ pc's i typically see people spend to get them.

    However, where I feel gauntlet is completely off track right now is rewards for ranks 2-10 (tier 2). In this regard, the gauntlet rewards for top 10 (tier 2) of gauntlet are being completely neglected and/or are obsolete.

    regarding chalua gauntlet ranks 2-10
    I was really hoping for an upgrade or replacement for BoM and potentially smite. I am quite disappointed that this does not seem to be happening and worse that 5pg "feels good" about where leaderboard rewards are and what they are accomplishing. The game has progressed with new magic that makes especially BoM a very minimal reward (Gag gift is basically free BoM for everyone). Unless you own BoM (which 99% of the population doesnt) most people dont care whether BoM or gag is on a raid reducing likelihood BoM gets saved a spot for raids and thus those of us that spent a lot to own it and benefit more from it lose out.

    If you won't upgrade these magics, at a minimum, please at least allow these magics to be kept by the victors similar to the troop in karaduchi. Allowing people to keep the magic seems very reasonable given the amount that people pay to get them and the fact that with the rate the game is progressing these magics will likely become devalued and obsolete within a year or two anyway. i think you'll find permanent rewards increase the value to the player and pc returns you'll see.
    spending money on it if its worth while. I spent $300-400 to get into top 10 of the gauntlet that ran in July or August when the rewards were still somewhat relevant.. see further
    Regarding karaduchi rank 2-10/tier2 rewards
    Tier 2 rewards for karaduchi were extremely disappointing and unimaginative, severely neglected, and an even further step back compared to chalua gauntlet tier 2 rewards.
    Tier 2 (top 10) rewards were barely better than tier 3 (top 50). A slight increase (10%) in legion bonus (if you dont already have the silver trophy) and a ring that is only +5% to att/def/perc more than the ring for tier 3. The exhault chest is a nice consolation prize for tier 2 but not unique or worthwhile (the chest would have given me 250 pc but i saved over 1000pc just by staying back in tier 3). I got into top 50 for free but would have cost me a minimum of 1000pc to get into top 10... this minimal difference in rewards between tier 2 and tier 3 gave no compelling reason to spend this kind of cash (for me) and likely why overall, people spent a lot less money/pc to get into the top10 than i've seen in the past.

    My suggested revisions to karaduchi gauntlet... For how much it costs to get into the Top 10, the rewards for top 10 should be more in alignment with the top tier 1 rewards and not tier 3/top 50 rewards. Along these lines maybe you could:
    1. increase the ring bonus for tier 2 to +15% att/def/perc
    2. what was most glaringly missing from this gauntlet for me.. if you have a high-end premium troop that you can keep for tier 1 then I think you would do well to add a unique premium troop you can keep to teir 2 rewards that is a step down from the tier 1 troop ( ie like BoM is to Smite in the chalua gauntlet)


    Further ideas after experiencing both gauntlet types .. please also seriously consider the following..
    1. Please expand the reward tiers. For example.. you could have tier 1 be the top 3 ranked players, tier 2 be top 3-15 and some similar expansion down for teirs 3 and 4. This will benefit player base with more rewards and 5PG with a lot more competition/pc spending, especially as you will have more players willing to chase the number 2 and 3 spots for top rewards similar to the push that always happens currently for the bottom few spots of the top 10 toward the end of each gauntlet

    2. If you wanted to change up bonuses a bit and keep pace with the current state of game and player interest you might consider having one gauntlet type keep +% to att/def/perc like karaduchi has currently and then switch the bonus to the other guantlet item/neck to be some varying degree of +% increase chance to crit and increase in crit damage for each different reward tier. Given how many people are loving their crit builds you will score big if you implement this

    Thank you for your consideration.

    Until, in particular this issue with top 10 rewards is addressed you will make it a very easy decision for me to spend zero pc on gauntlet.

  17. #17
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    another thing they could do with the gauntlet rewards. have say you pass gauntlet level 100 (just an arbitrary cut off point), have it save your highest ranking within that gauntlet. so if you get up to the 1st spot on Monday and then fall down later in the week have it keep track that you were in the first spot, once past the cut off level, at some point.

    then could give players rewards at the end based off of the highest rank they reached at any point within the gauntlet as well as the final ranking. could be something like anyone that every gets to tier 1 (ie the top spot), would at the end get the tier 2 (rank 2 to 10) rewards reguardless of where they end up at the end. and on down the line, if you ever get into tier 2, you are guaranteed to get tier 3 rewards at the end and so on. again this only if you get past a preset cut off level for the tracking to begin.

    the cut off for where the tracking starts would need to be high enough to avoid early on abuse/collusion from players in a chain jumping just 1 level higher, but the devs should have the back end metrics to have some idea of how the rankings progressed during each gauntlet so far to be able to use to make a good guess for where this should kick in at. it could be that the tracking wouldn't start until after 24 hours into the gauntlet perhaps so that the first wave of jockeying for position out of the gate is already done?

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    Question say what

    Hello. thanks for keeping the game up, its apreciated!
    I am getting the impression that devs cant handle more tasks at once, because it would be nice if the daily rewards could get some update, the craftables from daily tokens too. Another suggestion is that if during every patch, there could be an event running, other than ER or WR.
    Anyway, thanks again. hope you guys do the best to keep the game interesting and running.
    Last edited by Namagderas; 2nd March 2017 at 05:50. Reason: changing the meaning of my post
    Omer's Collar: proof that 5pg does bait and switch. never forget!
    Guster fault: just so you know, 5pg can and will reset or modify our characters whenever they see fit.
    "we'd like you, the community, to decide which Magics should appear on this raid."... uh, huh.

  19. #19
    Forum Moderator Nethlion's Avatar
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    Shamless plug about new perception sets

    I'm looking forward to the new camp and higher perception tiers. make them go to 1 million, for all I care. I'm pumping perception right now for higher crit damage, so it will be nice to see higher rewards as well.

    A personal raid for new perception tiers would be nice. Having it drop some of the event perception stuff (golden lotuses) would be neat for those that don't have EGG yet. I would love for pano to get a new line, as well as the Omni troops to get a new boost (recently posted that in the perception ideas thread).

    Gauntlet coming back is fine. I'll never get into the top tier rewards, but It's fun hitting the raids and getting the shop rewards. Really wish y'all would consider seperating IMMs and IDS/DGs into different categories, but I can understand not doing that as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thalain View Post
    Another interesting personal raid idea that could also well work as a perception drop: A raid with Health 1. Yes, 1. The catch: It has loot tiers - anywhere from a few m to hundreds of b. You get one hit and only one hit due to the 1 HP health and the oomph of that hit determines what you get. Could even come with a spike magic for personal raids. (10% chance to deal 250% damage. Additional 1750% damage on personal raids.)
    ^ I like this and it would be fun to have. Someday i wondered if this is was the case with Spectral erebus allready, but then the drops where just rare. But anyway i would like to see that.


    For Magic System i had a idea, but not sure if its good. But i will just leave it here:
    What about a system where you can click on the magic-slot and then can see the three magics of the ppl in your Army offering and can cast them yourself? So you can pick from the magics your Army wants to offer. But then again i feel like its too easy then... Maybe there is a better way to make this way, but not sure...

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